PrimalWoW WotLK - 5 September

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Roel
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PrimalWoW WotLK - 5 September

#1 » Post by Roel » 25 Aug 2020 15:22

While some of you wanted to see this news a year ago, this will come as a shock to others. We made the hard decision of rescheduling the merge of our realms to the earliest opportunity. This means the PrimalWoW community will no longer have a separate realm to progress through WotLK, all characters will populate one realm.

Unfortunately this is not a matter of choice, we simply don't have enough volunteers who are willing to do the grunt work for a successful WotLK launch. Our main developer has been overworked with crash fixes as stability comes first. And most of the people who were originally involved with the TBC launch have left so we have already been behind schedule for a while. The only other option is keeping it as a static TBC realm indefinitely which hardly anyone would be happy about.

Note that you're always free to progress through WotLK at your own accord, a disciplined guild could manage this. We have some ideas to support this playstyle as a compromise but again no work has been done yet.

Obviously the upside of a merge is population, there will be more people to play with. We will no longer have to split our limited resources over 2 realms. And in turn, our small server will have better chances of surviving. Players will also be able to enjoy features that have been exclusive to the TrueWoW realm, AHbot has been selling items for 2 months but there are no plans to adjust it for a PrimalWoW release.

The merge is expected to be ready within months so not immediately, more details and a specific date will still follow. It's also a big project that requires careful preparation and I am mostly doing that alone. If you're angry about this decision, I only ask that you don't take it out on staff members. Such an attitude is really demotivating and we will be worse off if they leave. If you actually want to help, send us a staff application and maybe you will make a difference.

5 September marked the release of WotLK on Primal and all 3.3.5a content is now available. AHbot has been enabled and the realms are now basically identical in preparation for the merge.
The realm type for TrueWoW was changed from PvP to PvE as agreed here.

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Elexias
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Re: Our Future

#2 » Post by Elexias » 25 Aug 2020 15:48

Hello everyone, I will give my suggestions here, hope that some of them will be implemented before merge.
I hope that by your post you did mean that we will have wotlk launch on PrimalWoW and then we merge with TW?
I really hope that we get more people on TW so our population stays perfect after merge. My suggestions are what most people think and I think we will lose less people if they or some of them gets accepted.

1) Allow us to have a pre patch on PrimalWoW, that includes giving us time to prepare for WotLK launch and give us Inscription profession, give us wotlk preparation scourge event (https://wowwiki.fandom.com/wiki/Patch_3.0.2), this is pre patch to wotlk.

2) Allow people on PrimalWoW to level before merge, there are people that love hard play and achievement farm, allow us to get realm firsts on levels, professions before merging us. There are people who have tons of mats and play on both PrimalWoW and TrueWoW, make it fair for us to level so please do not merge us before we get RFs.

3) PvP wise: Try to make a system with people suggesting that will not have us from PrimalWOW fresh level 80 blue geared to fight with Shadowmourne people from TrueWoW (Find a way to lower their gear or to SCALE it).

4) Give us realm firsts for raids for people from PrimalWoW. Also somehow scale down gear from ICC25HC and Halion 25 HC geared people when entering Naxxramas or any other raid with PrimalWoW people?

5) Gold difference between WotLK and TBC farming is huge, TBC dailies give less money and it is harder to get money general in TBC than in WotLK.

6) I beg other people to help staff and develeopers on PTR to find bugs and report em that will make it better for us when we get in WotLK stage.
Last edited by Elexias on 25 Aug 2020 16:24, edited 1 time in total.

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Nyeriah
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Re: Our Future

#3 » Post by Nyeriah » 25 Aug 2020 15:51

I have just a few considerations to make about this decision. I know how irreversible it may be and I understand that for you to take it there must have been a really long discussion, I certainly know it's not a choice to be taken easily. But...

- WoTLK content is the content that has been worked on the longest. The first raid that would be released is Naxxramas which was extensively worked during the Primal vanilla and shouldn't have any game breaking issues. This should give people almost a year of content to go through if you consider the side raids (EoE, OS) that can also be used to gain time while trying to get dev resources.
- We're finally getting on par with the actual patch the game is supposed to be played, so there wouldn't technically need to be any custom content tunning, which I understand is the heaviest grunt work to be done on any release.
- While I understand there may be issues to be addressed to perfect a release, they wouldn't be any different than the issues players already face on TrueWoW right now. What I am trying to say is, by the end of the day you'll still be offering Primal players the same content, but not in the way they expected to get it.

It's arguable if population is the major upside of this early merge, because this basically takes for granted that a Primal player will still want to play TrueWoW regardless of it not exactly being what they signed up for. They leave their characters on a TBC progressive realm and when they wake up they're playing on a fully progressed Wrath server with everyone running around on full RS25hc gear. It's certainly not something they expected.

Actually, for a really really long while I thought selling out a good Wrath release for Primal would have the chance of bringing people back and getting you some population. I believed with the right planning and enough marketing it'd be possible to at least have some people give it a second try. People love to check out new things, after all. But those expectations kinda sunk underneath the sand with this.

The only real upside of this from my point of view is less GM overload. Like not having to relog to complete a ticket or something among those lines.
“All your life, you will be faced with a choice. You can choose love or hate…I choose love.”
― Johnny R. Cash

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andriuspel
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Re: Our Future

#4 » Post by andriuspel » 25 Aug 2020 16:10

i feel bit pitty about this either, i actually indeed wanted to continue work, but raids (3.1 content least) still needs lots of work, naxxramas in other hand, lacks some of mechanics (like as in every high pop server), its missing movements, its missing a lot things. Its not even raids which needs work.

Nyeriah, progression on wotlk data still needs careful inspection, we planned 3.1 content, so argent tournament actually shouldn;t be existing, its not only dalaran vendors but also rest vendors which were nerfed in patches, spells werent addded into wotlk progression plan.

As Roel stated we indeed lack of man power, we're 1-2 devs currently, my schedule to work is getting shortened at most. I asked people to help with release, they tested, helped to find issues with willingness for good wotlk launch, basically i really was willing to continue but with current manpower we would end up +2-3 years of progression and even now we're stressed with our tasks for development, i really feeling pitty for these ppl who supported and helped me.

byself i have several ideas to make some possible workaround for PW players to compensate it, to maybe make work similar to ironman event, so people actually could do vanilla, tbc and wotlk progression without getting splitted (noting, its just base idea, i do not want to give promises). I Really thank for people who helped, they really well contributed for both realms.

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Bradonja
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Re: Our Future

#5 » Post by Bradonja » 25 Aug 2020 16:15

So basically a forced reroll on TW for primal players while our server gets shut down.

Yeah, not for me

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andriuspel
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Re: Our Future

#6 » Post by andriuspel » 25 Aug 2020 16:17

Bradonja wrote:
No, PW chars won't get lost.

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Doctor_J
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Re: Our Future

#7 » Post by Doctor_J » 25 Aug 2020 16:19

As with previous merges there has been no need to reroll your characters, your characters, items, guids will be preserved as they am now you will just login to Truewow. There maybe some complications with names but further details will be announced
Play Chars

Demonscream 80 Blood Elf Destruction Warlock
Mysteron 80 Undead Shadow/Holy Priest
Betelgeuse 80 Undead Arcane Mage
Esteban 80 Blood Elf Retribution Paladin
Artfuldodger 80 Human Assasination Rogue
Makka 80 Orc Beast Master Hunter
Cheetara 80 Tauren Balance/resto Druid
Gloriosa 80 Troll Resto/Elemental Shaman
Lucan 80 Undead Fury Warrior

Angelscream 80 Human Warlock

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gm's

Docmin
Docmina

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Nyeriah
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Re: Our Future

#8 » Post by Nyeriah » 25 Aug 2020 16:34

andriuspel wrote:
25 Aug 2020 16:10
Nyeriah, progression on wotlk data still needs careful inspection, we planned 3.1 content, so argent tournament actually shouldn;t be existing, its not only dalaran vendors but also rest vendors which were nerfed in patches, spells werent addded into wotlk progression plan.
Before landing on TrueWoW I had only played on progressive servers before (because that was the only thing known to man at the time considering basically nothing past Naxx worked on private servers). What we eventually did was just to disable the instances and work on the vendors. I know the vendor work is bothersome and takes time, but that's basically the most annoying part of it. The rest is just disables of dungeons, items, etc.

I don't think you can hide the argent tournament completely, but if you didn't want players to go there for roleplaying purposes you could make them be teleported away or something. Maybe leave Icecrown as a closed zone like blizzard usually does to end game zones nowadays (Tanaan, thal'dranath, argus, etc.) until the progression bits are updated.
“All your life, you will be faced with a choice. You can choose love or hate…I choose love.”
― Johnny R. Cash

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Bradonja
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Re: Our Future

#9 » Post by Bradonja » 25 Aug 2020 16:35

I know it's not a literal reroll, but starting at lvl70 is more or less a fresh start when you're rolling on a 10 year old fully progressed wotlk server. Having some transmog stuff doesn't really make a difference to me

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Stavromoon
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Re: Our Future

#10 » Post by Stavromoon » 25 Aug 2020 16:45

Whatever decision our devs decide to make, I will SUPPORT it. You are volunteers and not deserving of any criticism, sarcasm, etc.

Even though I do not relish leveling new toons on a PvP server (I have gankaphobia), it's still better than retail. WAY better.

If there is any way I can help, just ask.

Stav

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Orochy
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Re: Our Future

#11 » Post by Orochy » 25 Aug 2020 17:00

I support and encourage the plan of merging. I believe it will benefit TW as a server greatly. Pre-patch stuff from TBC to Wotlk, such as Scourge Invasion, would be cool to see but I don't know if and how realistically it would be done.
I see many benefits of the merge such as: lower workload of our GMs and developer/s, bigger population, with more people more "meat for the grinder" for raids, AHbot available to all, etc.
On the other hand, I'm highly against giving any Realm First achievements and tittles before/during/after the merge eventually happens, because other players whose servers merged with TW didn't get to keep them. Why should PW be any different? I'm also against scaling TW players for any content, either PvP or PvE to accommodate fresh 80s. I understand that the descrepencies between the two player-bases will be HUGE but scaling either side is not the solution, in my opinion.
Lastly i wanna give big THANKS! to Roel and the whole TW staff for all that you have done and continue to do for us at your own accord!!!
Cya in-game, cheers! 8-)

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Elexias
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Re: Our Future

#12 » Post by Elexias » 25 Aug 2020 17:05

Orochy wrote:
25 Aug 2020 17:00
I support and encourage the plan of merging. I believe it will benefit TW as a server greatly. Pre-patch stuff from TBC to Wotlk, such as Scourge Invasion, would be cool to see but I don't know if and how realistically it would be done.
I see many benefits of the merge such as: lower workload of our GMs and developer/s, bigger population, with more people more "meat for the grinder" for raids, AHbot available to all, etc.
On the other hand, I'm highly against giving any Realm First achievements and tittles before/during/after the merge eventually happens, because other players whose servers merged with TW didn't get to keep them. Why should PW be any different? I'm also against scaling TW players for any content, either PvP or PvE to accommodate fresh 80s. I understand that the descrepencies between the two player-bases will be HUGE but scaling either side is not the solution, in my opinion.
Lastly i wanna give big THANKS! to Roel and the whole TW staff for all that you have done and continue to do for us at your own accord!!!
Cya in-game, cheers! 8-)
Because PW is original realm of TrueWoW, not sure how many servers merged and when, probably in 2012 when I was in high school lel, it was long time ago.
Id rather make everyone go fresh at lvl 80 so we all start fresh gear wise, keep money, mounts, pets..

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nikkal
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Re: Our Future

#13 » Post by nikkal » 25 Aug 2020 17:10

Because PW is original realm of TrueWoW, not sure how many servers merged and when, probably in 2012 when I was in high school lel, it was long time ago.
Id rather make everyone go fresh at lvl 80 so we all start fresh gear wise, keep money, mounts, pets..
what?

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bobsmyname
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Re: Our Future

#14 » Post by bobsmyname » 25 Aug 2020 17:12

He means Primal is part of Truewow domain, ocmpared to other merged servers which were not part of truewow
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Elexias
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Re: Our Future

#15 » Post by Elexias » 25 Aug 2020 17:13

nikkal wrote:
25 Aug 2020 17:10
Because PW is original realm of TrueWoW, not sure how many servers merged and when, probably in 2012 when I was in high school lel, it was long time ago.
Id rather make everyone go fresh at lvl 80 so we all start fresh gear wise, keep money, mounts, pets..
what?
There hasn't been a merge of realms for long time, so not sure who and when earned realm first and never got that achievement on TrueWoW.
Would be nice when we merge with TW that all your gear get's scaled or idk, 95% of PW people will leave if you have Shadowmourne in pvp and we have blue crafted gear.

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